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03-09-2010, 02:04 AM | #41 |
Hardest E-thug around
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 970
Reputation: 38545 |
to be completely honest, i haven't watched the video from the OP. However, i've read all the posts following and i think this thread has spawned itself into one of the best i've read on RB...
As far as consent goes, i agree with most of the posters here (a much appreciated male opinion, i know), obviously a male shouldn't have such dire consequences levied against him from a woman who is merely regretting/forgetting the circumstances that led to her current position (namely, sleeping next to a male who she doesn't remember meeting)... There is a line where a woman is obviously too drunk to be making any kind of sound decision, sexual or not. If i have to help her to my car and up to my apartment, obviously she is far and past the line of consent... Forgive me, as i am not trying to be 'troll'ish, but...there has to be some measure of responsibility on the woman's part. If i (as a male) get wasted out of my mind and put myself in a position to get my ass kicked by a bouncer for talking shit, i'm going to jail (at least for the night) because i was drunk and i said i was going to hit him. There is no consideration given to the reasons that lead to me getting that drunk (for arguments sake a bunch of women giving me shots of JD all night) or to the fact that i might not have meant what i said while i was drunk. I am responsible for a)the decision i made to get wasted. b)the decisions i make in that state of mind. Why should it not be the same for women? (Again, ignoring the scenario where you are carried out of a bar because you are passed out drunk) The decision that the female made to this point was to let herself get drunk. No one forced her not to have the wherewithal to stop drinking when she got too drunk (at least, too drunk to consent). If i take her home, she's doesn't seem likes she's too wasted to make a decision, we've been having a good time all night leading up to this, and she never tells me to stop, why in god's green earth would I? I'm drunk as well, and i like vagina. Responsibility has to come in somewhere. People will try and take advantage of you no matter who or where you are (male or female). It is your job to be responsible for your self. If you don't feel like you can remain sober enough, bring a friend to watch over you, have the bartender call you a cab, or better yet, don't drink. I guess my whole point was that people (men and women) should be held to the same drunken expectation. If a female walks out of a bar on her own, to go to a guys house (who she's been flirting with all night) and never says no, what do you expect a guy to do? Is there a consent form that should be filled out prior to every drunken hook up? As a reminder: Bear in mind, my post is assuming you were able to leave an establishment on your own, instances where the females is too drunk to walk, or drugged are different scenarios than what i am arguing right now.
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I'm a drunken fool... |
03-09-2010, 02:14 AM | #42 |
Hardest E-thug around
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 970
Reputation: 38545 |
Re reading the OP, don't have my headphones, so i still haven't watched the video, but, as i can gather from the original arument...
i don't think a woman should be punished for her decision to look attractive, nor do i think it should have any merit on the discussion of rape fantasy. However, with an eye to my last post, i think Women should be aware of what they are wearing, and the ways they are acting, i don't think any woman dressed for a night out should be shocked that she might be attracting the wrong type of attention. What should go without saying is that she shouldn't be taken against her will, that said, in regards to consent, and a male's confusion on the matter, see my previous post.
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I'm a drunken fool... |
03-09-2010, 02:49 AM | #43 | |||||||
Hardest E-thug around
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 970
Reputation: 38545 |
i see now that my post did nothing but further move away from the op, however, i'm drinking and i'm self absorbed, so i shall let it stand until someone tells me i am a drunken, self absorbed fuck .
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before that happens for that one guy who the woman finds attractive, 3 guys will be rewarded by being told they're a great friend. Quote:
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I think women/'victims' (as you put it) get the same consideration, i think the problem comes when you're hanging over a person all night, and everyone thinks that they'd be stepping on your toes interfering. I don't think people would let you go home with a person you didn't want to go home with, or a person you didn't know who seemed insistent upon taking you home. so should the man assume there aren't going to be cookies? I don't think this is a particularly good example, but, if you imply that something is going to happen, wouldn't it make more sense to assume that it is going to happen than that it's not?
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I'm a drunken fool... |
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03-09-2010, 07:04 AM | #44 |
the obscure
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 3,457
Reputation: 14892 |
Come on my friend, how will they manipulate us if they do what they promise?
Keeping word is a men's-only value! For example, you promise relationship to get laid and next day you're gone; you are a twat. She promises sex to get favors and then she has headache; she is just a woman.
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..lure them all into the abyss! |
03-10-2010, 01:20 PM | #45 | |
Chinky Kinky Empress
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: hiding...
Posts: 678
Reputation: 31552 |
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Was she to call the cops before the sex? She doesn't want her ex to get in trouble. How would she possibly get to the phone without being hurt or harmed? Where's the fine line between saying no and a man's pressing demand blaming a woman that he got so worked up? Should Julie assume that because she fooled around that's agreeing to SEX even when she stated no sex many times, cautious of the fooling around? In the end, Julie didn't blame Steve about the sex. She played a part and she put herself in danger. Julie hoped that Steve may be respecting boundaries more and hoped he has learned from the past. Now, Julie realizes she was trying to get milk from a hardware store. Julie hurts from knowing she really did not want to have sex but got bullied into sex. Julie takes responsibilty for her part. Julie should have known better than to even want a hug or any physical affection. Steve should have never bullied Julie into consenting to sex. Who should take responsibility for what part?
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Purr...
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03-10-2010, 02:56 PM | #46 | ||
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 133
Reputation: 17279 |
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Also from the original start of this thread: Quote:
It's a bit of a side tangent but men do you really want women covering everything up if the law is changed to say women are responsible because of how they dress? Last edited by Fae; 03-10-2010 at 09:48 PM. |
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03-10-2010, 04:11 PM | #47 | |
Watching from the shadows
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No, it would take all the fun out of people watching.
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Tonight love, we'll do a rape roleplay No!! That's the spirit... |
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03-10-2010, 04:24 PM | #48 | |||
the obscure
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 3,457
Reputation: 14892 |
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Steve is a fucking rapist (besides being oppressive-urgent) and Julie has no responsibility because: he insisted on coming over- he wasnt invited she was clear since the beginning, no sex (regardless of her reasons; she has the right to say no just for the fan of it) she fought but he didnt stop kissing your ex is not provoking behaviour (especially if you have say -no sex!) accepting people you know in your home is not a dangerous action generally, she did everything she could do to avoid getting raped But i think nobody argues about stories like that one. Have you tried to make it a bit more complex? Lets say for example that she told him to come. She said she's fancy for a quick one. She was participating in foreplay. And then, she thought its not a good idea. What about that story? To me, Steve is still a rapist. He should have stop even if he was half way in. But hell, Julie shares a big part of responsibility; actually, she did everything she could do to get raped! I could even say, she caused her rape! Quote:
Many women want to be equal in their rights, but when it comes to obligations, they want to be ... women! Quote:
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..lure them all into the abyss! |
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03-11-2010, 01:27 AM | #49 |
The Resthome Rapist
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I assume this is a hypothetical...
Steve is a bastard, Steve should be fucking shot. So what if Julie wants a little play, a little necking. Julie has every right to set boundries and those boundries should be respected. More importantly Steve knew going in there were boundries. When those boundries were reached he should have stopped, plain and simple. I know, I know... I can hear the guys now "Hey, it's hard to stop, she got me all worked up.. I need to get mines". You know what... tough shit. Whem the girl says stop... you stop. End of discussion. Anything.... ANY-FUCKING-THING past that point is forced, it's rape. Steve is a fucking rapist, nothing more, nothing less. He's a god-damned, piece-o-shit rapist. Now the question is should Julie call the cops... tough call that. I want to say yes, I really, really do but I would advise she think about. There is no evidence of forced sex, she didnt fight, there was no struggle. It will be her word against his... this would be a very, very tough case to prove. Many DA's wont even take a case like this to trial because of lack of evidence. What I would suggest is that Julie cut off all contact.. I mean all. If she lives near him then move. If he continues to try to harrass her get a restraining order (yeah I know that's f'in weak but it's something concrete the DA can file charges on should he violate it). Beyond that, I dont know. With any luck it wont happen again, but I fear for Julie. I really do.
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