What's wrong with rape anyway?

[Sternenlied]

First of all we should be fair.
Chi, you can't on the one hand reject one generalization (all women don't want to be raped) and at the same time make another one yourself (all who fantasize about rape do want it to some degree). If I misunderstood your statement feel free to correct me.

In my opinion the difference between fantasy and reality is exactly what you don't like about possible live role-plays: The knowledge and security of the victim(s) that you can stop it at any time because after all it's only a simulation, a consensual sex game. Both partners involved (more eventually) always now it's all safe and sound and everyone can stop it at any given moment if they feel uncomfortable.

That is the fun most people have when doing a role-play ... the rape fantasy is acted out but in essence it takes place in your head. That's what you don't like ... you want real danger, the knowledge you can't stop what's happening. That is the huge gap between fantasy and reality - security.

[ChiTownHoney]

Originally Posted by Sternenlied

That is the fun most people have when doing a role-play ... the rape fantasy is acted out but in essence it takes place in your head. That's what you don't like ... you want real danger, the knowledge you can't stop what's happening. That is the huge gap between fantasy and reality - security.

That is exactly right and I agree with you (always can count on you to bring reason)

That is the very line that seperates rape fantasy from rape reality. The feelings of security and safety.

BUT as you already said, its not true for everyone. Your line may be a clear and concise line, but my line is not.

[doggystylethatgirl]

Originally Posted by Sternenlied

First of all we should be fair.
Chi, you can't on the one hand reject one generalization (all women don't want to be raped) and at the same time make another one yourself (all who fantasize about rape do want it to some degree). If I misunderstood your statement feel free to correct me.

In my opinion the difference between fantasy and reality is exactly what you don't like about possible live role-plays: The knowledge and security of the victim(s) that you can stop it at any time because after all it's only a simulation, a consensual sex game. Both partners involved (more eventually) always now it's all safe and sound and everyone can stop it at any given moment if they feel uncomfortable.

That is the fun most people have when doing a role-play ... the rape fantasy is acted out but in essence it takes place in your head. That's what you don't like ... you want real danger, the knowledge you can't stop what's happening. That is the huge gap between fantasy and reality - security.

So thats how it should be said !!

[ChiTownHoney]

Originally Posted by Noir

You propably haven't been browsing through the movie section of this board so when it comes to for example one realistic rape scene cut out from a movie there were many people who were disturbed rather than turned on by this kind of scene because their own fantasies were not on a level as close to the reality than the scene was on. In the end all of this does depend on the person in question since some might thrive for realism while others are comfortable on the level where the girl might start enjoying the act after resisting a bit at first.

I know very well about the disturbed videos people do not like.

You still havent addressed the main issue here.

Like I said already, there is a gap between fantasy and reality for you, but for me, its almost conflict. What does that make me in your eyes then? My fantasy is something I wonder about and think about all the time. I think about the reality and what would happen, and as Stern put it, I like the danger and the unknown. So your fantasy feeds into the reality. I have hoped for and thought about things happening, and to me, that is reality. The only problem is that it has only so far stayed in my fantasy and I havent had a taste of it. Maybe I dont want to, but maybe I do. Its a conflict.

I have always (and this may or may not be a shocker) thought special of real rape stories. No, I didnt get off on them. I just liked the emotions that flooded the victim, now this sounds really bad I know, but hear me out. The fact that I would read about these real rape stories, then look to the guy next to me and think of him....his strong arms pin me down to the ground and his cold eyes staring at me just like how the victim described. reality breeds fantasy. I thought how big can something be so that you as a victim are consumed by hurt and pain. How big and significant can one man be to inflict such pain on someone. I then again look to the guy next to me and wonder if he was capable of committing such an act of disgust, and that turned me on. Being afraid of men have always been a source of sexual pleasure for me. the reality at least bred my fantasy for sure.....if there was no reality of it, there would be none of this fantasy.

You cannot say with a straight face that you do not like the concept of rape. I am not seperating them at this point, I am talking about the concept. Of course, they are seperate I would be stupid to say that all who fantasize about rape will commit the act. The very concept of rape is special to us all. Just like the concept of rope is special, even though it was used to hang and lynch black people way back when.

[doggystylethatgirl]

Very Well Explained For Me

[Sierra]

Originally Posted by MADDOGMCMANAMAN

WHY ? i think it is one hundred percent correct, at least for me it is.

I dont get off on real abuse NEVER! the reason i get off on this rape shit is because I KNOW ITS NOT REAL ! and if it was i wouldn't be indulging in it.

Most of the rape stuff on this board is all about POWER PLAY and CONTROL, real life rape is CRUEL PHYSICAL ABUSE !

. . .

There is a very clear line between fantasy and reality, i think its huge, hell some people may think its not so huge - BUT IF YOU THINK ITS BLURRY - then that is whats truly laughable.

Although we come at it from opposite sides of the fence, Maddog, I couldn't agree more.

Trust me on this one - real rape is NOTHING like you think it's going to be. It's brutal and dirty and violent. Rape - real rape - is not a sex act, it's a crime of violence and robs the victim of her humanity and security. Real rape is not a game.

Also, in role plays the victim is not (or shouldn't be) in fear of losing her life. If she is, she definitely chose the wrong partner.

Originally Posted by doggystylethatgirl

That has got to be the hardest & craziest thing to explain - real rape from fantasy.
It's not easy having a feeling of a guy really forcing a girl if she doesn't want to, from reality of how much is too much force?
Asking, wondering, the feelings of not wanting that to happen, but just fantasizing about it.
You did gr8 on explaining what you did Chi !!

The difference between real rape and fantasy is simple and can be explained with one word.....consent. The power exchange games some or all of us enjoy are different in one crucial way...THE "VICTIM" GIVES CONSENT. Even with the most extreme forms of BDSM the submissive gives her power away. Likewise, even in the most violent rape role plays she has set limits and boundaries. We call this "consentual non-consent".

In rape games the "victim" has control of the on/off switch. Not so in real life.

[Noir]

Originally Posted by ChiTownHoney

I know very well about the disturbed videos people do not like.

You still havent addressed the main issue here.

Like I said already, there is a gap between fantasy and reality for you, but for me, its almost conflict. What does that make me in your eyes then? My fantasy is something I wonder about and think about all the time. I think about the reality and what would happen, and as Stern put it, I like the danger and the unknown. So your fantasy feeds into the reality. I have hoped for and thought about things happening, and to me, that is reality. The only problem is that it has only so far stayed in my fantasy and I havent had a taste of it. Maybe I dont want to, but maybe I do. Its a conflict.

I have always (and this may or may not be a shocker) thought special of real rape stories. No, I didnt get off on them. I just liked the emotions that flooded the victim, now this sounds really bad I know, but hear me out. The fact that I would read about these real rape stories, then look to the guy next to me and think of him....his strong arms pin me down to the ground and his cold eyes staring at me just like how the victim described. reality breeds fantasy. I thought how big can something be so that you as a victim are consumed by hurt and pain. How big and significant can one man be to inflict such pain on someone. I then again look to the guy next to me and wonder if he was capable of committing such an act of disgust, and that turned me on. Being afraid of men have always been a source of sexual pleasure for me. the reality at least bred my fantasy for sure.....if there was no reality of it, there would be none of this fantasy.

You cannot say with a straight face that you do not like the concept of rape. I am not seperating them at this point, I am talking about the concept. Of course, they are seperate I would be stupid to say that all who fantasize about rape will commit the act. The very concept of rape is special to us all. Just like the concept of rope is special, even though it was used to hang and lynch black people way back when.

I did mention how much these kind of fantasies can differ between inviduals and in your case the fantasies and the concept behind them appear to be rather different from the "normal" rape fantasies where the safety of the act is one of the most important factors at making it a pleasant experience.

I can say with a straight face that I do not like the concept of rape because personally I do draw a clear line between fantasies and reality but this kind of claim is indeed simplified to the point where I do include the actual concequences of the act in it because the whole base of the concepts we two are using appears to be incompatible with each other. You are still using your own personal views on rape fantasies as the base of these kind of arguments even though you did already admit how different your own fantasies are with their blurried lines mixing reality to them on steady basis...

[ChiTownHoney]

Originally Posted by Sierra

Rape - real rape - is not a sex act, it's a crime of violence and robs the victim of her humanity and security. Real rape is not a game.

Why is it that rape roleplay IS a sexual act then if the very concept of rape has nothing to do with sex? Real rape is VERY MUCH a sex act. There are different kinds of rapists and why they do what they do and its not ALL about power.

Originally Posted by Sierra

In rape games the "victim" has control of the on/off switch. Not so in real life.

Maybe you can generalize for most of the females in here but you cannot say the same of me. As you already know I am a different breed and dont form well into the mold. What most women like about rape roleplay is the control, and that is the very thing that I dont like because its just no fun.

Originally Posted by Sierra

Trust me on this one - real rape is NOTHING like you think it's going to be. It's brutal and dirty and violent. Rape - real rape - is not a sex act, it's a crime of violence and robs the victim of her humanity and security. Real rape is not a game.

The way you describe it, it sounds like such fun. You are talking to (or not, you were actually talking to Maddog ) a real life tease and tempter who has ran around with the most shadiest men around, I got a lick of danger and its so exciting.

[ChiTownHoney]

Originally Posted by Noir

I did mention how much these kind of fantasies can differ between inviduals and in your case the fantasies and the concept behind them appear to be rather different from the "normal" rape fantasies where the safety of the act is one of the most important factors at making it a pleasant experience.

I can say with a straight face that I do not like the concept of rape because personally I do draw a clear line between fantasies and reality but this kind of claim is indeed simplified to the point where I do include the actual concequences of the act in it because the whole base of the concepts we two are using appears to be incompatible with each other. You are still using your own personal views on rape fantasies as the base of these kind of arguments even though you did already admit how different your own fantasies are with their blurried lines mixing reality to them on steady basis...

All this rubbish and you still havent really responded to my post

[Noir]

Originally Posted by ChiTownHoney

All this rubbish and you still havent really responded to my post

Rubbish?

Well feel free to explain what is the main point I managed to miss.

[ChiTownHoney]

Originally Posted by Noir

I did mention how much these kind of fantasies can differ between inviduals and in your case the fantasies and the concept behind them appear to be rather different from the "normal" rape fantasies where the safety of the act is one of the most important factors at making it a pleasant experience.

I can say with a straight face that I do not like the concept of rape because personally I do draw a clear line between fantasies and reality but this kind of claim is indeed simplified to the point where I do include the actual concequences of the act in it because the whole base of the concepts we two are using appears to be incompatible with each other. You are still using your own personal views on rape fantasies as the base of these kind of arguments even though you did already admit how different your own fantasies are with their blurried lines mixing reality to them on steady basis...

Ok...lets see...

in your first paragraph you took about 15 words too long to say that safety is the most important factor in roleplay. I get that.

As for your second paragraph. I am sorry...I dont know what you are trying to say...there are literally 2...no wait...1 period in that whole paragraph. What is the basis of the concept we are using? Rape? Yes you include the consequence of rape as a reason not to rape. Anything else you said that I missed?? I know you are a college student, and I know that you tried very hard to write well...but it backfired and made you sound like a rambler.

[Sierra]

Originally Posted by ChiTownHoney

The way you describe it, it sounds like such fun. You are talking to (or not, you were actually talking to Maddog ) a real life tease and tempter who has ran around with the most shadiest men around, I got a lick of danger and its so exciting.

ChiTown, I truly, sincerely and no bullshit hope that you never find out how much fun real rape is. It has been 20 years this month since it happened to me, and I only have the nightmares occasionally now.

[doggystylethatgirl]

Originally Posted by Sierra

ChiTown, I truly, sincerely and no bullshit hope that you never find out how much fun real rape is. It has been 20 years this month since it happened to me, and I only have the nightmares occasionally now.

I am sorry that really happened to you.
I hope you peaceful dreams in the future Sierra !

[ChiTownHoney]

Originally Posted by Sierra

ChiTown, I truly, sincerely and no bullshit hope that you never find out how much fun real rape is. It has been 20 years this month since it happened to me, and I only have the nightmares occasionally now.

Thanks for your kind wishes.

I know I will never be raped in real life, and it disappoints me a bit, but oh well.

If only I can find a way to fulfill my longing in a different way..

It seems very terrible what you went through, and I am sorry, but I know I will never understand that.

I just dont know why or how it can take that much of a devastating toll in your life. Its only your body. I have been gropped, assaulted, etc...I was even touched inappropriately in the grocery store by a strange man when I was little. All that stuff I remember, but I dont even blink an eye. It doesnt bother me. It doesnt bother me so much that I want more assault, more danger. Nothing done to the body can be that bad. The only thing that gives me nightmares is Chuckie ^, Goddamn you doggystylethatgirl!

Honestly....I have gone through worse than assault and rape (in my opinion anyways)....some things that I would never wish on anyone. And I'm still here.

[ego]

Originally Posted by ChiTownHoney

Why is it that rape roleplay IS a sexual act then if the very concept of rape has nothing to do with sex? Real rape is VERY MUCH a sex act. There are different kinds of rapists and why they do what they do and its not ALL about power.

Thx. I was feeling lonely.

[MADDOGMCMANAMAN]

Originally Posted by ChiTownHoney

Its only your body

ahem..... I WANNA SEE YOUR TITS !!!!!!!!!!!

[ChiTownHoney]

Originally Posted by MADDOGMCMANAMAN

ahem..... I WANNA SEE YOUR TITS !!!!!!!!!!!

no you dont trust me. They are not nearly as big as your taste allows.

[doggystylethatgirl]

Originally Posted by ChiTownHoney

no you dont trust me. They are not nearly as big as your taste allows.

I wanna see your ass - clothed, wearing tight skirt or nude.

Maybe show us your legs if you don't wanna show anything else.

I could imagine Honey dripping down your legs while I lick it off.

Not show us because I (or we) will abuse the pic, I wanna get to know what it is exactly behind those posts of yours - even if its just a pic of your legs.

[MADDOGMCMANAMAN]

Originally Posted by ChiTownHoney

no you dont trust me. They are not nearly as big as your taste allows.

there all good to me ! ( . Y . )

[Uncle Al]

Originally Posted by Sternenlied

Don't forget bunnies ...

Please, try to keep the bunnies out of this.