Does a woman ever deserve to be raped?

[rasputin]

Originally Posted by somedude

Warning for personal insults outside the Rowdy Room!
I suggest you let this drop while you still have legs to stand on Rasputin...

Could you please clarify what the personal insult is? And I'll let it drop as soon as Stern does.

It was she the one who responded to my post, and not the other way around.

And I don't need no warnings from you, Somedude. Fact is, Stern got her ass kicked, and you had to come to her rescue when you saw your little bitch in trouble.


And now, you can ban me if you want to. Permanently, too.

See if I care.

Good bye.

[somedude]

Well if you insist...RASPUTIN IS BANNED FOR A WEEK!

[doggystylethatgirl]

[theDarkOne]

Originally Posted by somedude

Well if you insist...RASPUTIN IS BANNED FOR A WEEK!

Originally Posted by rasputin

Hey, if some of you earlier posters who voted "No" in the beginning would like to change your vote, please feel free to announce it here and we will count it against your earlier decision.

I voted no and after reading your posts RASPUTIN then STERNENLIED's view my no has turned into a NO.

[MARADONA]

Originally Posted by rasputin

Could you please clarify what the personal insult is? And I'll let it drop as soon as Stern does.

It was she the one who responded to my post, and not the other way around.

And I don't need no warnings from you, Somedude. Fact is, Stern got her ass kicked, and you had to come to her rescue when you saw your little bitch in trouble.


And now, you can ban me if you want to. Permanently, too.

See if I care.

Good bye.

Rasputin i told you it was going to happens...if you want to leave RB you can go without act in this way...jeez...
i just hope it will be clear in your head that we like you and we don't want to loose you forever...
beh i hope you will consider this...you have a full week for think about it. I will not say nothing else...

[AWDracer]

Since this is a public thread, I'm going to voice my opinions on it.

The short answer to this, for me, is, No, nobody deserves to be raped. Yet at the same time, there are instances where if you screwed, you screwed up.

For me, to revise what rasputin said, "saying she deserved it" doesn't necessarily mean we condone the rape.

A lot of rapists and liars who make sex crimes DO deserve to have retribution onto them in some way of form (i.e. in prison that we don't hear about)

That being said, I don't think the people who raped another (no matter how righteous it may be) deserves to be in society where they may harm others.

This is pretty much a watered down version of rasputin's view.

[AWDracer]

Originally Posted by AWDracer

Since this is a public thread, I'm going to voice my opinions on it.

The short answer to this, for me, is, No, nobody deserves to be raped. Yet at the same time, there are instances where if you screwed, you screwed up.

For me, to revise what rasputin said, "saying she deserved it" doesn't necessarily mean we condone the rape.

A lot of rapists and liars who make sex crimes DO deserve to have retribution onto them in some way of form (i.e. in prison that we don't hear about)

That being said, I don't think the people who raped another (no matter how righteous it may be) deserves to be in society where they may harm others.

This is pretty much a watered down version of rasputin's view.

To elaborate a bit further, although this might be a bit extreme, we're looking for justice. It's nice to say "no, nobody deserves to be raped" but do you think you could normally hold out your emotions when some loved one of yours was hurt by it? The answer is, I don't think so.

I'm not blaming the justice system because there's no middle ground on these issues but for most, it will seem inadequate. I'm not doubting the people who are righteous enough to say they wouldn't want something to happen to the attacker, but when it does happen, things aren't as sunny as people are imagining it to be.

If a girl ruins your son who, otherwise had solid grades and popular - but he didn't do it! - just for her attention and pity, don't you think something should happen to her? She's basically wishing for it to happen. The son's reputation could be disastrous; you couldn't send him into a prestigious school because of it.

Likewise, if a man rapes your daughter, don't you think some thing should happen to that man?

I think so!



I know that if I had a daughter, I'd be seriously considering about doing something to him (i.e. killing them) but maybe stop short of actually doing because I would fear the consequences of getting caught.

[Rogue]

My answer is no and it's probably a poor reflection on humanity that you really have to ask.

Rape has no rehabilitating, positive value and as it's so unique to each person's destruction or altering of their life, that it can't be calculated to be a worthy form of revenge or not. Can it really fall under the category of "eye for an eye" in the case of a woman who falsely accuses a man of assault? She may have ruined his life dramatically, but she didn't put a dildo in his ass. If she went on to be attacked herself for real this time, for all you know she may move on swiftly and still be as evil as she was the week before.

Having said that, to add to Sierra's point that "once we start thinking of ourselves as judge, jury and executioner, we cross a line that we really don't want to cross" - I wonder if we already have with executions. Law, governments and people have determined that certain people "deserve" to have their life ended, which in the black and white of things, is far worse than being raped. You may or may not recover fully and lead a normal life after an assault, but death is pretty much the end of you.

If the question is, would I feel sorry for her? Again, there are factors to consider. To expand on AWDracer's post, are you personally involved? That'll change your opinion pretty fast. Do you know someone who was a victim of rape or were you a victim yourself? Well, it's pretty unlikely those people will wish it on even the lowest of scum.

Again I would use death to put it into perspective somewhat. When you read a tiny article about a middle class man's murder half way across the world, do you feel sad? Then, what about the rape of a pretty woman in your town that has a lot of media coverage? You feel sorry for people based on your own personal compassion and who they are, not on how ironic it is.

[AWDracer]

Originally Posted by Rogue

My answer is no and it's probably a poor reflection on humanity that you really have to ask.

Rape has no rehabilitating, positive value and as it's so unique to each person's destruction or altering of their life, that it can't be calculated to be a worthy form of revenge or not. Can it really fall under the category of "eye for an eye" in the case of a woman who falsely accuses a man of assault? She may have ruined his life dramatically, but she didn't put a dildo in his ass. If she went on to be attacked herself for real this time, for all you know she may move on swiftly and still be as evil as she was the week before.

Having said that, to add to Sierra's point that "once we start thinking of ourselves as judge, jury and executioner, we cross a line that we really don't want to cross" - I wonder if we already have with executions. Law, governments and people have determined that certain people "deserve" to have their life ended, which in the black and white of things, is far worse than being raped. You may or may not recover fully and lead a normal life after an assault, but death is pretty much the end of you.

If the question is, would I feel sorry for her? Again, there are factors to consider. To expand on AWDracer's post, are you personally involved? That'll change your opinion pretty fast. Do you know someone who was a victim of rape or were you a victim yourself? Well, it's pretty unlikely those people will wish it on even the lowest of scum.

Again I would use death to put it into perspective somewhat. When you read a tiny article about a middle class man's murder half way across the world, do you feel sad? Then, what about the rape of a pretty woman in your town that has a lot of media coverage? You feel sorry for people based on your own personal compassion and who they are, not on how ironic it is.

Fair enough.

The middle class man who is mediocre in looks might not have a large fan base as the pretty woman you mentioned, but they are likely to have someone who loves them. While the dramatic "mob effect" won't show up for the man, if he gets murdered, their folks are going to want to know why it happened and how it's going to be dealt with in finding the criminal.

And because of the folks' relation to the people, the effect remains the same - this is assuming that his folks didn't conspire his death - someone is going to be looking for revenge.

Whether this is a good or bad thing, it's not my call to say.

[SecretObsession]

Interesting that it's worded, "does a woman ever deserve to be raped"... Leaves it open for many interpretations

Isn't it only opinions that can determine what someone might "deserve"?

[ChiTownHoney]

I think that rasputin needs a word limit on his posts! Just suggesting...

[mifje]

How is it possible somebody get banned with this subject on this board? This is a forum meening you should discuss things!!!!! You can never expect that everybody agrees with each other!! So use the board for discussion but this should be done without insult. Just respect everybodies opinion even when you don't agree. ( No i am not taking anybodies side....)

[Sternenlied]

Well, somedude merely warned him for personal insults which is - no matter the subject - not allowed outside the Rowdy Room.
Rasputin wasn't banned as a result of the mentioned warning but simply because he asked for it and - as some members might have noticed - us moderators have grown rather tired of this so we just grant those kind of requests.

When rasputin returns from this ban however he will receive his second warning for personal insult (his post following somedude's) and receive his official ban for it.

[AWDracer]

Originally Posted by Sternenlied

Well, somedude merely warned him for personal insults which is - no matter the subject - not allowed outside the Rowdy Room.
Rasputin wasn't banned as a result of the mentioned warning but simply because he asked for it and - as some members might have noticed - us moderators have grown rather tired of this so we just grant those kind of requests.

When rasputin returns from this ban however he will receive his second warning for personal insult (his post following somedude's) and receive his official ban for it.

Well don't you think a double ban for one "crime" is a bit too harsh?

[doggystylethatgirl]

well, im throwing my two cents in

I VOTED FOR THE FIRST ONE

No. Nobody deserves to suffer rape and humilliation. It debases us as humans.

Dumb question to ask, but I see it's getting some attention.
Now rasp knows how it feels to be locked out of a web site

It's funny that - rape is illegal - fantasy rape isn't - nobody really wants rape - but there is a shitload of vids out there.

Does anything ever make any sense nowadays?

[Sternenlied]

Well don't you think a double ban for one "crime" is a bit too harsh?

Why?
If you insult someone, you receive your first warning.
When you insult someone again (doesn't matter if it's the same person, the same thread, the same day) you receive your second warning.

Like I said, the "timetable" was this:

1) Insult
2) First warning for insult
3) Second insult + plus asking for a ban
4) Received ban for asking for it

Now what is to follow:

5) Second warning for second insult

The second warning bring a week's ban with it and he shall receive it.

[ego]

Originally Posted by Sierra

It is a soul-destroying crime of violence that reduces the victim to subhuman status. Killing and/or beating someone does not have the same dehumanizing effect. Even the worst criminal deserves to have their humanity acknowledged.

I believe that the word "rape" as it is defined by law means so many things and situations that a simple and totalizing statement like the above will inevitably be wrong and insufficient to describe many of the cases.

To put it simple, don't measure other people's corn by your own bushel.

Originally Posted by Sternenlied

People, justice systems, governments, whatever ... who decide to put blame on the victims - especially when based on clothing, walking route, etc. - are just sad and I despise this kind of thinking.

Although i want to support the right of people to dress and act anyway they like, i have to support as well their right to live without be exposed in temptation.
Prevention in our case would save two people, two people who would going on their normal lives if motivation was absent.
Plus, we could be sure about people who act without any motivation given: they dont belong to a healthy society.

[Fibonacci]

I'll keep my vote for myself But this is the same as death penalty for me. I was always for it, but if it comes to voting, I'd vote NO. Just because of this:

Many that live deserve death. And some die that deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then be not too eager to deal out death in the name of justice, fearing for your own safety. Even the wise cannot see all ends.

J. R. R. Tolkien, The Lord Of the Rings, Book Four, Chapter One
British scholar & fantasy novelist (1892 - 1973)

This is so terribly true.

[Sternenlied]

Originally Posted by ego

Although i want to support the right of people to dress and act anyway they like, i have to support as well their right to live without be exposed in temptation.
Prevention in our case would save two people, two people who would going on their normal lives if motivation was absent.
Plus, we could be sure about people who act without any motivation given: they dont belong to a healthy society.

Not arguing right now, just making sure I got you correctly:
You're saying you would generally support a society in which nobody has to fear for their safety because of the way they dress, the roads they take, etc. (the victims in this case)?
You're also saying you would like for other people to live without being tempted (the rapists in this case)?

So you think without the temptation of the women in sexy clothes passing through the dark alley, the man being there at the same time wouldn't be tempted (by her looks and presence) to rape her and thus wouldn't become a rapists while she wouldn't become a victim?

Isn't that somewhat like blaming the beer for being there and tempting the alcoholic to drink it?

The man being "tempted" still has a choice to act on that temptation or not. If he gives in into the temptation presented, isn't it still his fault since it is ultimately his choice to do so? Same as the alcoholic doesn't have to drink the alcoholic beverage simply because it's there.
In my experience a man isn't that aboulic a being not able to resist. However if somebody "has it in them" to commit a rape it will happen anyway, sooner or later, tempted or not.

[AWDracer]

Originally Posted by Sternenlied

Not arguing right now, just making sure I got you correctly:
You're saying you would generally support a society in which nobody has to fear for their safety because of the way they dress, the roads they take, etc. (the victims in this case)?
You're also saying you would like for other people to live without being tempted (the rapists in this case)?

So you think without the temptation of the women in sexy clothes passing through the dark alley, the man being there at the same time wouldn't be tempted (by her looks and presence) to rape her and thus wouldn't become a rapists while she wouldn't become a victim?

Isn't that somewhat like blaming the beer for being there and tempting the alcoholic to drink it?

The man being "tempted" still has a choice to act on that temptation or not. If he gives in into the temptation presented, isn't it still his fault since it is ultimately his choice to do so? Same as the alcoholic doesn't have to drink the alcoholic beverage simply because it's there.
In my experience a man isn't that aboulic a being not able to resist. However if somebody "has it in them" to commit a rape it will happen anyway, sooner or later, tempted or not.

I agree with you Stern.

It doesn't make sense to me that people would get off easy when they can use things as an excuse to commit crime.

Being an alcoholic still isn't a crime, I'm sure you know this, but it reads like it is a crime, especially when comparing that with seeing a sexy woman walking down with a temptation that you MIGHT do it.