I had a look at the IMDB review and all the actor and producer names seem to be Irish. It gets a 7.4, so could be worth watching. It's not every day that 38 men escape from the most secure prison in Europe.

Badly.

Bit of bad news for Northern Ireland. Bombardier, which employs 4200 people in Belfast have been hit with a 200% duty tariff on airplane exports to the USA. Apparently US commerce regulators view bailouts received from UK and Canadian governments as a subsidy that gives Bombardier an unfair advantage over Boeing. There is a counter argument that Boeings massive defence contracts with the US government is effectively acting as a subsidy.

A final judgement on this will be made in February. In the mean time, people in Belfast are understandably nervous. It is reckoned that a further 9000 jobs are supported in the supply chain, mostly in Northern Ireland, as well as other businesses that benefit from those people being in work.

New news today is that one of a series of Royal Navy frigates to be built in the next few years will be named HMS Belfast. The original HMS Belfast, built at Harland and Wolfe shipyard in Belfast in 1938, now a floating museum on the Thames near Tower Bridge, will be renamed to reflect this development.

Just a fucking shame that the new boat can't be built at Harland and Wolfe out of common fucking courtesy!

Harland and Wolfe was a key cog in the old order in the north. employment there ensured a stable, if not comfortable life for a man and his family. Unfortunately where someone chose to spend an hour on Sunday morning determined whether or not they got a job there.

given it will take a few years to complete the ship, perhaps this would be a more appropriate name for the new owners for the Belfast, " i mBéal Feirste". It would be a nice going away present from the Royal navy.

That makes no sense at all.

I'll give you that one, two bottles of merlot don't make for lucid posting

Yeah I've been there myself more than once, drinking and posting. Up this far north (especially in Winter) there is fuck all else to do. When it snows, we can't get out to the bar so we have to drink at home. A few beers by an open fire, laptop to hand. It's a recipe for embarrassment. ;)

A good drunk poster should have no shame!

Look bright side, now you know how to say
the " The Belfast" in Irish.

But probably only when drunk. Otherwise it's a mouthful of double-dutch to me. ;)
It's an interesting thread all the same.

It's best learn to
Irish when drunk, it follows none of the conventions an English speaker finds when learning French or Spamish

I learned a bit of Irish as a child. But it is a very difficult is very tough one to master if you start from scratch. Nothing like learning French or Spanish

1. I only may know how to spell it, saying it might be some thing else altogether. 2. I wrote "may" because I am not interested enough to go back and read the post again.

As prosecutions of soldiers involved in the Bloody Sunday riot of 1973 are being considered, it has emerged that new evidence uncovered by the Crown Prosecution Service has led to a recommendation that two former IRA members also be prosecuted for their part in the disturbances.

They probably threw stones at the poor soldiers who were armed only with rifles. :)

It is true that none of the rioters shot by the army were armed. Those were rioters though, not necessarily members of the IRA. Martin McGuinness by his own admission was there and armed that day. It is established that the army came under sniper fire, though nobody seems to know if this started before or after the army started shooting.

The "massacre" itself was actually a series of incidences, rather than a mass opening fire on a crowd. Perhaps some people reading have a vision in their mind of small stones being thrown, but what usually happens in Britain is that paving slabs are lifted and smashed in to large chunks, then thrown at the police. Or army as it used to be in Ulster. Some of the stones were being rained down on the "poor soldiers" from inside an abandoned building.

It is worth noting the events than led up to Bloody Sunday. Violence had become so common place, pretty much a daily occurrence, that all marches and parades had been banned in the province. Despite this, another protest march had taken place two weeks before which ended in the inevitable stone throwing and retaliatory beatings. Of course, none of this, or the actions of protestors on the day, justify those soldiers opening fire. It probably does help explain why they would though.

The news report I read about the IRA members being recommended for prosecution, didn't name them, or describe what they had done. I seriously doubt if the CPS are concerned with a couple of stone-throwing youths 45 years after the event though.

I've posted a number of times in favor of a full amnesty for anything before the good Friday accords. For all, the IRA, the security forces, even the loyalists, I get the argument of families seeking closure, but prosecuting elderly soldiers or guerillas isn't going to make them feel any better

Amnesty. Yeah.... Problem is, some paramilitaries benefitted from organised crime. Some British soldiers disobeyed orders and sent inexperienced youths to shoot stupid stone throwing boys. Some paramilitaries terrorised the communities they claimed to represent and defend, and deliberately and cynically attempted to inflame the situation. What ever the arguments for and against Irish independence are, I don't think any one should be immune from prosecution. I think the prosecution needs to be comprehensive, and the punishment fitting.

It's all well and good to hold everyone accounted, but some of the incident in question are 40 years old. The pain is already voicing concerns about the amount of resources they have to devote to "legacy" investigations

Yet here we are, still prosecuting Nazi prison camp guards over 70 years later. Or looking for some one to blame for football stadium disasters after nearly 30 years.

The Nazi war criminal analogy doesn't really apply. There was nothing that happened during the troubles that rivaled the pure evil of the Nazis.

The problem in the north is that there are two almost numerically equal populations that have totally different views of recent history. Given there is no way to prosecute every offence, it just makes sense to clise the book on it all. Anything after good Friday should be vigoursly prosecuted.

My understanding is that anyone charged with offences pre-Good Friday agreement won't serve any jail time if they are found guilty. The process seems to be just about closing files on historic cases.

no, you can still receive a two year prison sentence for pre good Friday offences. and it's not clear if this applies to members of the security forces.

Here is the problem, who do you choose to prosecute? An IRA ambush, armed combat with the British army that resulted in the deaths of British soldiers. Under the law this is murder.

another example, less clear. I can't recall the details, but two RUC constables on foot patrol. Two IRA volunteers walked up behind them and shot them both in the back of the head. Two armed agents of the state killed in combat, or two policemen murdered doing their jobs?

Or do you limit prosecution to the killing of civilians? the loyalists were allergic to engaging an opponent who might be able to shoot back. But republicans killed civilians as well. Do you prosecute the Enniskillen bombers? How about the execution of British informers?

One of the most horrific episodes of the troubles was the Shanklill butchers. a loyalist gang that kidnaped nationalist civilians, tortured, mutilated and murdered them. The provos tracked down the leader of the butchers, and shot him to death leaving his mothers home. My point here being, regardless of the victim being a degenerate animal, does this allow the state to excuse what under the law was the murder of an a unarmed civilian.

All these questions can be put to bed with a general amnesty.

I thought they had that already? Obviously I was mistaken. :cool:

There is no amnesty for British soldiers. Only paramilitaries.

My personal thought is that there should be justice, but that justice is better served if tgere is also peace. All involved should be immune from punishment, but there needs to be some sort of system where by we ccan discover who did what. So that people can look at members of their own community and know for certain who the killers were. Make up
Their own minds.

As time runs out for the new generation politicos at Stormont, whilst Hillary takes her incredulity (its called "What Happened") on tour around the UK, Billy Pantsdown has been tagging along and thought he would pop in on Arlene and the other bird for a "wee chat to see if we can sort out this trouble".

The Northern Ireland situation made the TV news here this weekend. It isn't very often that Ireland gets a mention, so it does seem to be taken seriously at this point in time.

James Brokenshire is to make a statement in the House of Commons tomorrow as yet another deadline to reach an agreement passes at Stormont. Meanwhile it is the political classes wet dream scenario as unelected civil servants continue to spend the cash that Theresa May bribed the DUP with, whilst the politicos look on helplessly. Been taking lessons from the European Union it seems!

Any update on this FR? No mention of it in the news this side of the world.

The DUP and Sinn Fein have been given another 24 hours to make a deal!

I think they are flogging a dead horse.

Some Irish government minister, whose name I can't be arsed to learn is whining that Brexit negotiations are taking too long, and the vote should be reversed. Or some such bollocks. Not a helpful attitude, given that the bigger of the major players in Stormont wants us out of the EU.

another extension, another hopeful statement the parties are making progress. Sinn Fein is not going to budge on the Irish language act, and this has nothing to do with the popularity or lack there of Irish usage in the day to day life in the north. The passage of the act establishes Irish as a separate language, culture and ethnicity as distinct from the rest of the UK. This is a key step on Sinn Fein's road to reunification.

Sinn Fein should throw them a bone on the inclusion of Ulster Scots as a recognized language. while I'll allow Irish is not that widely used in the north, the number of Ulster Scots speakers could probably be counted on both hands. Some of the smuggling and fuel laundering on the border has some of its business conducted in Irish, pretty sure the UDA has not done a heroin deal in Ulster Scots.

The flaw in this thinking is that Sinn Fein, and Ulster for that matter, are not currently on the road to reunification. The idea of an ethnic minority is flimsy at best. A religious minority, sure, but religion is not ethnicity. Sinn Fein seem to be locked in some naive political and econmic state. A failure to reach an agreement could see them lose the ground they’ve taken. Though in fairness the same could apply to Arlenes mob.

That's possibly because several vote results in Ireland were overturned on second ballots. The Lisbon Treaty was one, where the electorate told the EU to fuck off with it. Then the Irish government ran a campaign of scaremongering before a second ballot was held, which saw the Treaty accepted.
If the Brexit vote was rerun, I'd put money on the stay in vote winning.

Really? The remain campaign had the backing of every single political party in the UK, except UKIP. It had £9million of taxpayers money putting the governments case for remaining in the EU. It had more or less the entire political establishment threatening economic and environmental ruin, along with a terrorist onslaught and world war three if the United Kingdom left the European Union. On top of that, there was Barry and Hillary threatening to send us to the back of the trade deal queue if we left.

Yes, but now the scaremongering seems to be making Brexit look like real and imminent doom. More so because the people at the top who wanted Brexit have no idea what is going to happen after they leave the EU.

Yes, doom and gloom, meanwhile the economy is growing, exports and manufacturing keep going up, more jobs are being created in the UK than ever before, foreign investment continues. The only uncertainty is in the fearful minds of the political class whose nest has been lined by EU membership.

Any way, back to Northern Ireland. The SDLP are placing the blame for failure of negotiations with Sinn Fein as James Brokenshire introduces a Budget Bill to Parliament. It would seem only Sinn Fein wants all that extra cash the government bribed the DUP with to be spent on dual language road signs and public information leaflets.

Take a drive around Wales, and only road signs are in both English and Welsh. No business bothers with dual language because it is costly and pointless because every one speaks and reads English any way.

Dual language road signs are always popular with tourists, so they have some usefulness. Also they might play a small part in keeping awareness of a declining language in younger people, lest they otherwise forget.